Building Resilience: The Power of Other Care and Positive Psychology with Iuri Melo

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iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: when

we're on our phones, we're just elsewhere.

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the quickest way for you to create

misery in your current life is

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to wish you were somewhere else

or in some way to be elsewhere.

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The understanding that the way that

we interpret the events in our lives

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matters more than the events themselves.

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Right?

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obviously we, we have

to care for ourselves.

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We have to care about our lives.

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Um, but the reality is that other care.

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Is actually a much

better mood boost, right?

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So if you're interested in raising

the way that you feel like improving

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your wellness, your meaning, your

mattering in life, the quickest

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path to that isn't self-care.

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It's other care.

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Russell Newton: Hello listeners

Thank you for joining us today.

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Our guest is Iuri Melo.

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is a licensed clinical social worker, as

well as the co-founder of School Pulse,

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which you can find at school pulse.org.

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Iuri, as we normally do here, take a few

minutes, introduce yourself, and we'll

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let the conversation go from there.

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iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

I love it.

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Russell, thank you so

much for letting me come.

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I love the, I love the topic, I love the

title of your podcast and, uh, I hope

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that I can find lots of fun ways with

maybe some ideas and some strategies to.

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To make those skills Right.

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Really come to life to your listeners.

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But, so yeah, my, my name is Iuri Melo.

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I'm a, I've been a licensed clinical

social worker now for a long time.

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Most of my time and experience

has really been as a

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psychotherapist, uh, of 21 years.

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I'm still doing that, uh, while at

the same time trying to, to create

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this, this wonderful service that

started about seven years ago.

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And maybe I'll tell you just a

little bit about that in a moment.

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But I'm, uh, originally

from, from Portugal.

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I was actually born in Africa, a long

ways away, then moved to Portugal, grew

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up there, then came to America right at,

at the age of 15 and have stuck around.

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And, uh, I have to admit, it's,

it's been a real, a real fortunate

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and a real blessing in my life.

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I'm a married man.

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My wonderful Katie.

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I've got five incredible kids.

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Uh, three of them that are kind of

out of the house, one that's here, but

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that's about to be gone in about a week.

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And then we'll be left with our

amazing little girl who's well little.

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She's 14 and kind of just

starting high school this year.

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And, uh, uh, it's, it's, it's

been a really wonderful time.

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I, we live in a, in a wonderful place.

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If, if any of you are familiar with, uh,

Southern Utah, we're about an hour and 45

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minutes away from Las Vegas in this little

pocket of just beautiful high desert.

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We're kind of in between the

Grand Canyon, lake Powell, Bryce

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Canyon, Zion National Park, and St.

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George just kind of resides in

that kind of high altitude desert.

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And, uh, as a result

of that, there's just.

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Unbelievable.

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Beautiful world class climbing all around.

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Um, and I've been climbing now for a lot

of time and actually was kind of, uh, a

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founder in a way, in a unique way of what

I call it venture based therapy, which

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is actually, I actually take my amazing

clients and we take advantage of this

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incredible location, and we rock climb,

we boulder, we do canyoneering, we do

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repelling, and we use that as kind of

part of this therapeutic experience, not,

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not just as, as like a vehicle to kind

of communicate some sort of a therapeutic

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concept, but as I say to my clients,

like, by the time you and I are done,

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you're gonna be a legitimate climber.

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Like, so this'll be.

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A skill, right?

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Something a a, a piece of mastery that

you can utilize at any point in your

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life and just enjoy and just be outside,

exercise and do something incredible.

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And so that's just a little bit about me.

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We, we started School Pulse

about seven years ago.

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I'll tell you briefly

about that, if that's okay.

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Uh, interestingly enough, uh, as

probably as it is with most things

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we've kind of recognized, or, or, or

really the program came as kind of

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the genesis of, of some crisis that

was happening here in our community.

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We had, in 2017, uh, we lost about seven

students to suicide here in our community.

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It was.

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Odd actually, in the whole state of Utah.

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It was just, it was odd.

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Uh, there, there were lots of

suicides, lots of student suicides,

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and a good friend of mine who was a

local principal here, uh, a principal

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that I believe is a real innovator,

uh, and definitely whose focus was

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on just student wellness and student

excellence, and he reached out to me.

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By then, I had written a couple of

books and, uh, he, I think his concern

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obviously, because he had lost a couple of

students to suicide, some of my children

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were actually going to that school.

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Uh, and he just felt like all that

he really had at his disposal were

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just reactive tools in a sense.

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He saw himself kind of passively

waiting for crisis, and then the

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crisis would blow up and then

everybody would kind of rush around.

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Did the best that they could to

intervene and to, to bring peace,

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to restore some peace back.

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But he decided that he

wanted to do a lot more.

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Um, and so we kind of had these

mastermind type discussions and

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brainstorming sessions about what we

could do, you know, whether we could

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add more resources or, or how could

we be a little bit more proactive

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and truly preventative, not just.

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Not just act in kind of an

intervention type of way.

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Uh, and then I reconnected with a

good friend of mine who's a software

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engineer, true genius, uh, who helped

us to kind of put this idea together.

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And within very quick moment,

we decided that we were going to

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proactively engage students via text.

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Uh, and then later on a few years,

we actually ended up not, not only

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continuing to do that, but actually

providing a live team of support.

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And so throughout the year, during the

summer, over the holidays, before and

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after school, we have this incredible

team that we train that provides

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these students with an enthusiastic,

kind, gentle, and understanding voice.

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We have the most comprehensive mental

health resource for teens in the world.

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And I know that that.

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It can sound so silly and

and cliche, but it really is.

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We have it, we created it, we put

it together, uh, and we deliver that

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to schools in addition to another,

to a whole suite of services.

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And, and I think, Russell, you were

mentioning that you were a school

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counselor, uh, at, at one point.

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And that's actually one of those pieces

is our hope is that we can walk into

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any school and immediately amplify and

multiply their ability to reach out

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to students and to provide support.

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And so whether you're, you're

an administrator, right?

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And you're looking to enhance, you know,

the, the mental fitness of your students,

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the ex, the student success of your

students, we can help you to do that.

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We're evidence-based.

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We're, we're grounded in positive

psychology, growth mindset, and other

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cognitive behavioral strategies.

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And we can come and deliver

just extraordinary value.

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Uh.

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Some of our stories, honestly,

Russell, I mean, are just, I mean,

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they're just like Nobel prize winning

type stuff that's just incredible.

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All the way from students who

are just doing wonderful, right?

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And we're enhancing their experience

all the way to students of course

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who are deeply troubled, right?

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Who are struggling with, you know,

symptoms of depression or anxiety, or

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whose parents are divorced or they're

reporting physical or sexual abuse,

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or they themselves are having suicidal

ideation or self-harming or homicidal

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ideation all the way to school shootings.

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I mean, these are just things that

we have dealt with and are dealing

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with throughout the country.

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Uh, but we're so honored.

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Our outcomes are just phenomenal.

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And it's amazing to me, you know,

that we can do so much good, uh,

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not just through some of our amazing

resources that we deliver to schools,

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but also through our live text-based

support and our email campaigns.

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It's just really exciting, um, but really

challenging y'all at the same time and

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I'm sure you're quite aware of that.

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So, so that's just a little bit about me

and what I'm kind of doing right now, but

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Russell Newton: Thank you for that.

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Uh,

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iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: bet.

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Russell Newton: I say we as a society,

I think appreciate the kind of

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efforts that you put forth in the.

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The health and safety of our children.

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It makes me a bit emotional,

just, uh, hearing the story

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of, of you and what you do.

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I know how difficult it is.

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I just to get this, you were working as

a social worker and you teamed up with

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the principal that was an educator.

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Did I get that right?

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iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah.

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So the genesis of our company began there.

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The other co-founder is, is Trent Staler.

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He's the software engineer.

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So him and I actually kind

of grew the company together.

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Uh, this principle in, in a way is

still connected with us, is still

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involved with us, but he was really

kind of the, the force, right?

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Like this is happening.

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He came to me, we began the conversations,

and then Trent and I, right.

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We really kind of took this and have

grown it over the past seven, eight

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years, uh, into what it is now.

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Which to be very honest, it's,

I, I mean, I still look at us.

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I mean, even though we're seven

years in as really a startup, like,

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I mean, it's, I mean, every, every

year we're just, we're creating more.

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We really just try to

listen to school counselors.

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We try to listen to administrators.

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We try to listen to supers.

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We try to understand like,

what's the problem, what are the

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problems, what are the struggles?

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And then we literally just come

in and plug in the solutions.

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Uh.

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Obviously, and from a very biased

perspective, we believe that we're just

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doing it better in a more complete, uh,

and streamlined way than anybody else.

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And so we really kind of, I like to say

that when, whenever we present ourselves

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to a school, we really like to present

ourselves to them as a, as a multi-tier

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solution, you know, to whatever issues

they're dealing with specifically.

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Obviously with student success, student

suicide prevention, student wellness, you

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know, whatever word they're using, social

and emotional learning opportunities.

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And we just come in and provide kind

of the, you know, the Walmart version,

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well, maybe not Walmart, maybe more

like Target, like a target solution

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or Costco solution to their, just

like, to what they're looking for.

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And so.

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It's, it's cool, and especially whenever

we talk to school counselors, man, I mean,

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we just like, we just blow their minds.

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They're just like, oh my gosh.

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Like, you know, why didn't

we have this earlier?

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And it's, and it's incredible.

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And so it makes us really happy because we

can connect so well with that population.

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And in a sense they, they're really

the mental health hub of the school.

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Right.

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Even though as a school counselor,

I, I dare say that they probably

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do less of the counseling Right.

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And much more of class management,

graduation and things like that.

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They probably spend a lot of time

dealing with scheduling and probably

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a little bit less time doing more

of that kind of mental health

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or, or student wellness, which is

probably where they would rather be.

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Uh, but kind of, they don't

have a lot of time to do that.

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So for us to come in and provide

that additional help and really to

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make them look super awesome because

we can just connect them with.

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Really nice resources, which I will

share with you Russell, for you,

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for your listeners, for you to go

look at and take full advantage of.

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And you don't have to put in an email or

anything like that, or it's just yours

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to go look at and for your parents to go

look at especially and uh, we really want

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to give out some, some value for sure.

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Russell Newton: You said uh, was it

: 2017

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of suicides in the state, uh, that I

did teach in a small private school

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and worked my way up, taught for

many years full-time, and then worked

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as a counselor per for a few years.

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so in a small school we didn't have

the kind of that the public schools

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do, but even in that small school,

we did experience a few suicides,

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throughout my time

there, over a period of.

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About 13 years or so, and it

really is devastating, even to

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people that didn't, might not have

known that individual, just to,

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to know somebody was in that

difficult of a situation and it was

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unknown to everyone around them.

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And my mind keeps coming back to that

because it's a, you mentioned, uh,

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the range of students that you talk

with, those that are doing well, you

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helped you better those that are not

having the best of times, you make

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things, uh, a little more bearable

and those that are really struggling.

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And my thought when you said

that was, you know what?

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It's so difficult to know which kid

that is it could be the starting

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quarterback that is really struggling

and experiencing abuse and having those

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ideations you talked about it, it,

it could be the real quiet kid that's

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just really enjoying his time and.

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experiences it differently than others.

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We don't know from day to day what a,

a particular individual is experiencing

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and thinking and feeling at that time.

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It's a really difficult thing I, I just

can't say enough, I don't how valuable

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that service must be to school counselors,

to parents, to students and their friends.

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Was there something in 2017 maybe

that triggered this, this space?

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I don't want to get into any, I don't,

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iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Sure.

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Russell Newton: don't, don't ask this as

a political or economic or any kind of

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iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

No, no, no.

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Russell Newton: that many, in that

short of timeframe, in that geographic

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location seems, uh, I'm sure it was

an anomaly from the normal statistics

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to put it coldly of, of a year.

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iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Uh,

it, it, it was, I, I think that there was

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an increase, I think in 2016 and 2017.

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Uh, and interestingly enough, kind of

in this mountain west region of kind

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of Montana, Wyoming, Idaho, Nevada,

Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, uh, those

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states, interestingly enough, many times

I at least, you know, compared, I think

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with, with other states in the country,

uh, just experience a little bit of

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a higher, a higher rate of, of, uh,

of, of teen suicide than other states.

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As far as the reasoning behind

that, I mean, I would say that,

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that it definitely falls within it.

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I mean, there wouldn't have been anything

really specific there that's happening

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in that state compared to others.

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Uh, but definitely falls within,

I think about, uh, you know,

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I wanna say 2010 plus, right?

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When we begin to see a lot of these,

um, mental health concerns or these

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mental health trends that all begin

to kind of trend in a negative way.

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So, and, and I think we've certainly

seen that now, and I think, I think it

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was Vi Murdoch, uh, what's his name?

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The, the general, um, oh my gosh, I

can't think of his name anyways, but

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he's, he talked about the youth mental

health crisis and really said that it's

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kind of the defining crisis of our time.

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Uh, and he was really talking about

just this incredible amount of students.

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And I'm sure that as a teacher

and as a school counselor, you saw

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that as well, where we're not just

talking about, uh, really extreme

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behaviors, but really high numbers.

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Uh, of students who are reporting, uh,

feeling consistently sad and hopeless.

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Like we're talking like, uh, like

40 to 50% of like high school

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and secondary age students.

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We're talking about, um, about 30%

that reported, you know, feeling

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or having suicidal ideation.

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You know, within, within the

past year we're talking about

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the highest levels of anxiety.

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We're talking about just a

significant amount of issues.

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And there are, I, I think that there's

been some really interesting research.

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I'm sure some of your listeners have

read the book or heard of the book.

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Uh, the Anxious Generation where

the author, I think poses some

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pretty interesting, and I feel well

researched and well documented.

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Maybe some persuasive arguments as

to where all of this is coming from.

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He actually begins that, uh, by

turning the focus a little bit

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to our, to parents a little bit.

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Um, I don't think in a real

blamey type of way, but I think he

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presents some information that's

very interesting, especially to

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me as a parent about adolescence.

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Right.

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Uh, and specifically I think

targeting the idea, right?

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That we, that we ourselves

in, in a way are creating some

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of this anxiety in our kids.

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Some of our own

overprotectiveness, some of, uh.

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I, I think in a sense, in some ways,

we sometimes preach fear to our

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children, um, instead of confidence.

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Uh, and then of course he talks

specifically about, um, phones and the

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incredible, uh, the quick rise of this

technology and the significant impact

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that it's had on our children, uh, in

this kind of loneliness epidemic, this

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epidemic of anxiety and depression.

295

: 00:18:33

And, uh, and I think he creates a, a

pretty compelling argument that that

296

: 00:18:39

has had a truly significant impact,

not just in the lives of adults, which

297

: 00:18:44

we can certainly feel that right.

298

: 00:18:46

Uh, but obviously in

the lives of our kids.

299

: 00:18:49

And I say that not really from

a fear, fearful perspective, I'm

300

: 00:18:53

actually quite optimistic about it.

301

: 00:18:55

And I feel like our children will

actually find a way to, to deal with that.

302

: 00:18:58

They will respond, uh, even though right

now I think that there's absolutely

303

: 00:19:03

some negative outcome for them, I think

they're gonna find a way to manage that.

304

: 00:19:07

Unfortunately, we've placed that in their

hands and I think they'll probably end

305

: 00:19:11

up dealing with it better than we have.

306

: 00:19:13

Uh, but they are gonna have to walk

a little bit through that valley

307

: 00:19:16

of the shadow of death a little

bit and deal with some of the

308

: 00:19:20

negatives that we can measure, right?

309

: 00:19:23

In terms of anxiety, in terms

of loneliness, in terms of

310

: 00:19:26

social disconnection or low

loss of connectivity to others.

311

: 00:19:30

Uh, and that matters.

312

: 00:19:32

It matters a whole lot because

the best predictor that we have

313

: 00:19:36

of short and long-term success,

uh, are positive relationships.

314

: 00:19:41

And when you have something in your hands.

315

: 00:19:45

That continuously pulls you from

where you are into some other place.

316

: 00:19:51

Uh, we can't help but to

feel somewhat disconnected.

317

: 00:19:54

Um, and so in fact, I think that there's

a quote in that book that really stuck

318

: 00:19:59

out to me where it talked about this

current registration or, or generation or

319

: 00:20:03

these teens who are constantly elsewhere.

320

: 00:20:07

And just think about that, right?

321

: 00:20:09

When we're on our phones,

and this includes me, I'm

322

: 00:20:11

not here to pick on teens.

323

: 00:20:12

I love teens, but, um, when we're

on our phones, we're just elsewhere.

324

: 00:20:18

And think about that, right?

325

: 00:20:19

And, and I feel like something that I

constantly tell people is, the quickest

326

: 00:20:23

way for you to create misery in your

current life is to wish you were somewhere

327

: 00:20:28

else or in some way to be elsewhere.

328

: 00:20:31

And so.

329

: 00:20:32

Part of, you know, some of the

content that we have, obviously

330

: 00:20:36

for kids, it's really optimistic,

it's really encouraging.

331

: 00:20:39

It's, I mean, we're totally

grounded in positive psychology.

332

: 00:20:42

I'm not here to preach or to rant

in a negative way, but I absolutely

333

: 00:20:47

want to give teens some solutions

to help them to be where their feet

334

: 00:20:53

are instead of just disengaging.

335

: 00:20:56

And that includes in like sitting down

watching a movie and really just be

336

: 00:21:01

there and watch the movie instead of

like, the TV is on and I'm on this

337

: 00:21:06

right, kind of doing my own thing

and so is everybody else in the room.

338

: 00:21:11

And that's kind of just the

reality of where we are.

339

: 00:21:13

And I, I see that around

me and I recognize that

340

: 00:21:17

there's some real loss there.

341

: 00:21:19

Like there is, there is some real loss.

342

: 00:21:22

I wanna be optimistic and I

am, but I'm also saddened that.

343

: 00:21:29

These incredibly amazing tools

that we have just literally

344

: 00:21:36

just envelop us into this little

cocoon and we enter that world.

345

: 00:21:43

And the negative side of that is

that we exit our reality, right?

346

: 00:21:48

And kind of in a sense, kind of dripped

into this multiverse a little bit.

347

: 00:21:53

Um, so that's kind of what

he's, he's talked about.

348

: 00:21:58

And, and I think once again, the evidence

as we look over the past decade of this

349

: 00:22:03

new technology, the evidence is very

convincing that phones unfortunately have

350

: 00:22:11

had a, a really detrimental impact in the

lives of children and adults in a way.

351

: 00:22:16

Of course, there are wonderful

things and we wanna, we wanna build

352

: 00:22:18

those, we wanna teach kids how to

utilize all the wonderful things

353

: 00:22:21

that phones provide and that, that,

that, that technology is providing.

354

: 00:22:26

Uh, but the reality is.

355

: 00:22:28

It's also created a, a multitude

of challenges for them, challenges

356

: 00:22:34

that I believe they will cross

and become better as a result.

357

: 00:22:38

I, I think, I think they can find a way to

consecrate that experience for their good.

358

: 00:22:44

Um, but, but there's some negative

pieces there that, that are

359

: 00:22:48

challenging for them right now.

360

: 00:22:50

Russell Newton: Absolutely.

361

: 00:22:51

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah.

362

: 00:22:51

Russell Newton: Uh, and uh, I just

wanted to say, as I say in many of

363

: 00:22:56

our episodes, what works for a high

schooler that's feeling alienated or,

364

: 00:23:04

uh, dissatisfied, depressed, any range.

365

: 00:23:08

Of emotions or thought processes there.

366

: 00:23:11

The things that work for a teenager

that you're propounding proposing, uh,

367

: 00:23:15

expounding, whatever the right phrase is,

368

: 00:23:17

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

Sure, sure.

369

: 00:23:17

Sure.

370

: 00:23:18

Russell Newton: for work

for college age students.

371

: 00:23:20

They work for young adults,

they work for parents.

372

: 00:23:23

Uh, they might be presented

differently, but it's the same concepts.

373

: 00:23:27

And

374

: 00:23:29

in doing this podcast for, for many

years, uh, it comes back so many times

375

: 00:23:37

to the same basic things, but still it

seems that they have to be taught a new

376

: 00:23:44

and, and listeners come in, you know,

new fan, new people to the podcast.

377

: 00:23:49

But the, the, the concept of just

being present, uh, that they, I I was

378

: 00:23:57

formulating a question as you were

talking for, my question was gonna

379

: 00:24:00

be, if someone is feeling that way,

what piece of advice would you give?

380

: 00:24:05

And then you immediately.

381

: 00:24:06

Uh, gave a solution for the problem

you presented, so appreciate that.

382

: 00:24:09

If you're, if you're feeling disconnected,

the best solution are real relationships,

383

: 00:24:16

uh, and to experience the now.

384

: 00:24:18

And also I was reminded very strongly

of, of Eckhart Tolles, the Power of Now.

385

: 00:24:22

Are you

386

: 00:24:23

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

Oh yeah,

387

: 00:24:24

Russell Newton: Absolutely.

388

: 00:24:25

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah,

that was, it's like a top 10 for me.

389

: 00:24:27

That's a good one.

390

: 00:24:28

Russell Newton: great.

391

: 00:24:28

Great.

392

: 00:24:29

Yeah, a fantastic book.

393

: 00:24:30

Uh, think it gets anywhere near

the attention that it should, uh,

394

: 00:24:35

and a really quite a simple book.

395

: 00:24:37

Uh, and it, uh, the title

encapsulates the entire book.

396

: 00:24:41

I mean, it takes some explanation

to get the concept across, but,

397

: 00:24:46

so let's take a step back.

398

: 00:24:47

You, you said your, your practice is based

mostly in, or maybe you should tell me,

399

: 00:24:55

you mentioned CBT, uh, and the, so your

techniques and, and your theory of, of

400

: 00:25:01

treatment based in CBT or draws from that.

401

: 00:25:05

Is that right?

402

: 00:25:06

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

It, it is.

403

: 00:25:07

Yeah.

404

: 00:25:07

I, I, I think as a therapist over the

years, and I do lots of things, but,

405

: 00:25:11

uh, I mean including experiential

type things, but, but I do have

406

: 00:25:18

a, a tendency to kind of practice

this type of psychology, right.

407

: 00:25:24

That focuses, I really to say on

the power of our psychology, right?

408

: 00:25:30

The understanding that the way that

we interpret the events in our lives

409

: 00:25:37

matters more than the events themselves.

410

: 00:25:39

Right?

411

: 00:25:39

And it's, and it's this idea, right?

412

: 00:25:41

It's, it's this idea that,

413

: 00:25:43

Russell Newton: Yeah,

414

: 00:25:44

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: sure,

415

: 00:25:44

Russell Newton: that is,

416

: 00:25:45

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: it,

417

: 00:25:45

Russell Newton: strong.

418

: 00:25:46

We can't

419

: 00:25:46

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: yeah.

420

: 00:25:47

Russell Newton: We do say

it frequently, but yeah.

421

: 00:25:49

Repeat that phrase and then continue on.

422

: 00:25:50

I apologize for interrupting

your thought there.

423

: 00:25:53

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

No, no, no.

424

: 00:25:53

Not at all.

425

: 00:25:54

I can, lemme see if I, so the way that

I would say it is, in fact, I would

426

: 00:25:58

say it within the idea of like, that

your psychology is everything, right?

427

: 00:26:03

Like your ability to interpret.

428

: 00:26:08

The events in your life matters more

than the events themselves, right?

429

: 00:26:12

And, and we're just these meaning

making machines like that's, or

430

: 00:26:17

these spiritual, these souls, right?

431

: 00:26:19

That, that, and that's what we do.

432

: 00:26:22

Uh, and when we do that

incorrectly, right?

433

: 00:26:24

When our lenses, right, when

we're looking at the world from

434

: 00:26:27

a real pessimistic perspective,

uh, then life is really difficult.

435

: 00:26:31

And actually, I mean, life is difficult

even with the optimistic ones.

436

: 00:26:35

It's just that an, an optimistic lens

allows you, it, it energizes you, it keeps

437

: 00:26:42

you lit, it keeps you going, it keeps you

persistent, it keeps you moving forward.

438

: 00:26:47

And it, whereas that kind of

pessimistic, pessimistic lens, right?

439

: 00:26:51

When we feel like events are permanent,

that problems are pervasive, uh,

440

: 00:26:56

when we feel like we're to blame

and that we're powerless, like

441

: 00:27:00

when we feel and believe that.

442

: 00:27:02

Then there can only be one outcome, right?

443

: 00:27:05

And that is a loss of energy.

444

: 00:27:07

It's a loss of motivation, and we end

up feeling hopeless and powerless.

445

: 00:27:11

Right?

446

: 00:27:11

And so even if we were just talking

kind of about the difference, right?

447

: 00:27:15

Between kind of pessimism

and optimism, right?

448

: 00:27:17

We're really talking

about a cognition, right?

449

: 00:27:20

It's, it's a pattern of thinking.

450

: 00:27:21

It's a pattern, it's a way, a

mental strategy of looking and

451

: 00:27:25

interpreting the events in your life.

452

: 00:27:27

And when we view things, let's say

from an optimistic perspective,

453

: 00:27:32

uh, I mean, it's just proven right?

454

: 00:27:33

We perform better period, we

perform better for longer, we

455

: 00:27:37

perform better during challenging

times, and we feel more hopeful.

456

: 00:27:42

We, our mood has improved.

457

: 00:27:43

Our sense of energy and motivation is

improved simply because we can learn.

458

: 00:27:50

And I think that's a really key

piece of just cognitive behavioral

459

: 00:27:53

therapy and really positive

psychology or growth mindset.

460

: 00:27:56

Psychology is this idea

that we're not these rigid.

461

: 00:28:02

Creatures.

462

: 00:28:02

Right?

463

: 00:28:02

I'm not just like a pessimist

or naturally unhappy, right?

464

: 00:28:07

The idea here is that we can learn these

things, we can learn optimism, we can

465

: 00:28:14

learn to have a better perspective.

466

: 00:28:16

We can modify the lenses through which

we see the world so that we can see a

467

: 00:28:21

better, more helpful reality, right?

468

: 00:28:25

And so, cognitive therapy, right, is

really born from this concept, right?

469

: 00:28:30

That when we can change our cognition,

when we can change our interpretation

470

: 00:28:37

of life, then our life changes.

471

: 00:28:39

The events in our life changes.

472

: 00:28:41

Uh, another, you know, fabulous book, uh,

you know, man's Search for Meaning, which

473

: 00:28:46

I'm sure you've heard of, or I'm sure

that your readers have listened to, right?

474

: 00:28:49

It is all about that, right?

475

: 00:28:50

It's about taking something

right that is so immensely

476

: 00:28:54

difficult for us suffering, right?

477

: 00:28:58

But viewing that suffering.

478

: 00:29:00

From a lens that is a little

bit more empowering, right?

479

: 00:29:04

That allows us to not just be resilient,

but actually allows us to grow, right?

480

: 00:29:12

Which is pretty daring actually, right?

481

: 00:29:15

I mean, whether you're thinking about,

you know, man's Search for meeting

482

: 00:29:18

or some of our incredible veterans

or soldiers or, uh, active, uh, you

483

: 00:29:24

know, police officers or people who

are doing some of these crisis things,

484

: 00:29:27

those are really challenging, right?

485

: 00:29:29

I mean, I can't imagine there being

something that's more terrible for

486

: 00:29:34

the human psyche than just combat.

487

: 00:29:36

Like, it just has to be

so unbelievably difficult.

488

: 00:29:41

And yet the goal, and I say this with

incomplete ignorance, that I have not been

489

: 00:29:47

in that place, but with total compassion

and hope for those individuals that I've

490

: 00:29:51

had the pleasure and honor of helping and

treating and assisting in my profession.

491

: 00:29:57

But my goal for them is never to,

if I dare to be really bold, my, my

492

: 00:30:04

ultimate goal, and I might not even say

it out loud to them, it isn't just to

493

: 00:30:11

be resilient and get back to normal.

494

: 00:30:14

My goal for them is, man, I, I

wanna take everything that's,

495

: 00:30:18

that has occurred to you.

496

: 00:30:19

And in some way I wanna synthesize that

and somehow make that I, I want to,

497

: 00:30:27

the word that I'll use right, is to

consecrate or to make it holy for you.

498

: 00:30:32

Like I want you to come out

better, wiser, stronger.

499

: 00:30:36

Like, I want that experience to somehow

like become this beautiful thing, right?

500

: 00:30:42

Like beauty from ashes sort of a concept.

501

: 00:30:45

Um, and I say that once again.

502

: 00:30:47

I fully acknowledge

totally ignorantly like I.

503

: 00:30:53

I don't know their experience.

504

: 00:30:54

I certainly don't pretend to

know, and I would never say that

505

: 00:30:57

I do, but that's my wish for them

as their friend, to be honest.

506

: 00:31:01

Like, I wanna take everything

you've gone through and I

507

: 00:31:05

wanna somehow like mix that in.

508

: 00:31:07

And in the end, I want it to be awesome.

509

: 00:31:09

I want it to be beautiful.

510

: 00:31:10

I want it to be a source of strength

instead of a deficit for you.

511

: 00:31:14

Like a hundred percent.

512

: 00:31:16

And I wanna do that same thing for

myself, uh, in, in that respect.

513

: 00:31:20

But anyways, I, I, I think cognitive

therapy, I wanna say that that's kind

514

: 00:31:26

of like the golden standard of therapy.

515

: 00:31:28

I mean, it's well documented,

it's well-researched, the

516

: 00:31:31

evidence backs it up, right?

517

: 00:31:33

When we are able to change, right?

518

: 00:31:35

Our interpretation of events, our

thinking, the way that we view our

519

: 00:31:40

external reality, um, we do better, right?

520

: 00:31:45

When we can recognize

some of our distorted.

521

: 00:31:48

Thinking, right?

522

: 00:31:49

Whether it be our, you know,

our catastrophizing, right?

523

: 00:31:53

Or whether it be like the way that we

generalize events, you know, well, this

524

: 00:31:57

happened to me then that means it's gonna

happen to me now and it's gonna happen

525

: 00:32:00

forever and ever and ever and ever.

526

: 00:32:02

Well, that's how the brain runs.

527

: 00:32:04

That's how the brain, the

brain predicts future events.

528

: 00:32:06

The problem is, it's not true, but this

is what the brain does all the time.

529

: 00:32:13

And so by helping people recognize

some of these fallacies, right, some of

530

: 00:32:17

these patterns of thought that generally

originate in the brain, but that

531

: 00:32:23

aren't productive, they're not helpful.

532

: 00:32:26

They're kind of originating from

a survivalistic organ, right?

533

: 00:32:30

That's meant to protect us.

534

: 00:32:32

But that, in a sense, kind of

fails to help us to thrive, right?

535

: 00:32:36

Or to really grow and progress.

536

: 00:32:38

And that's where, you know, I think

positive psychology can come in.

537

: 00:32:42

That's where a lot of.

538

: 00:32:43

Other philosophies or even the

world's religions can come in, right?

539

: 00:32:47

Where we're really looking for a way to

thrive instead of just focusing on the

540

: 00:32:54

negative aspects of the human condition.

541

: 00:32:56

Right?

542

: 00:32:56

Uh, which has also been kind of

a really interesting shift in

543

: 00:33:00

psychology, you know, for really for

the entire history of psychology.

544

: 00:33:05

And psychology has really been focused

on the human defic deficiencies, right?

545

: 00:33:10

I mean, we've written five versions of

the diagnostic statistical manual, right?

546

: 00:33:16

That basically list every possible

diagnostic that, that, that we can

547

: 00:33:20

have that's wrong with this, right?

548

: 00:33:21

All the way from how depressed we are,

OCD, obsessed, I mean everything, all

549

: 00:33:26

the personality disorders and positive

psychology has really come in, you know,

550

: 00:33:31

over these past few decades and really

said, Hey, we need to make a shift

551

: 00:33:35

right away from just listing the human

deficiencies and really talking about.

552

: 00:33:43

Not just what we're doing well, but

more importantly, how do we go about

553

: 00:33:48

living a really good or wonderful

or meaningful or purposeful life

554

: 00:33:55

and figuring out how to do that.

555

: 00:33:59

And so it's really moving away from

this medical model of therapy, right?

556

: 00:34:04

Which is, you know, you break your

arm, you go to the doctor, right?

557

: 00:34:07

We're kind of almost passively

waiting for crisis to occur to what

558

: 00:34:11

I feel is a much more preventative,

proactive, focused on how we can really

559

: 00:34:18

live wonderful lives that we feel

good about, that we feel proud of.

560

: 00:34:24

Even when there is sadness,

even when there is grief,

561

: 00:34:27

even when there is anxiety.

562

: 00:34:29

So I, I'm quite the fan.

563

: 00:34:32

I think that that movement

has been wonderful.

564

: 00:34:36

Uh, and interestingly enough, it's,

it's reflective of some, of, some of

565

: 00:34:40

the Eastern philosophical teachings.

566

: 00:34:42

It's really, you know, it really

connects well with even some of

567

: 00:34:45

the religious, you know, whether

they be Christianity or Judaism.

568

: 00:34:49

And so it's, it's really important.

569

: 00:34:52

I, I feel like psychology

has made a real positive turn

570

: 00:34:55

at, at least in that respect.

571

: 00:34:58

Yeah, that's probably more than

you wanted to know, but geez.

572

: 00:35:02

Russell Newton: no, I, I

appreciate all those insights.

573

: 00:35:05

When I, when I first heard the

term positive psychology, not

574

: 00:35:08

that many years ago, really.

575

: 00:35:11

I think I interchanged it in

my head with pop psychology

576

: 00:35:14

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah.

577

: 00:35:15

Yeah.

578

: 00:35:15

Yeah.

579

: 00:35:15

Russell Newton: kind of dismissed

it and I'm, I'm wondering if our

580

: 00:35:18

listeners might feel the same way.

581

: 00:35:20

Um, yeah, positive psychology is very,

is is interesting because it, I used

582

: 00:35:28

the terms in a episode a few weeks ago.

583

: 00:35:31

It's eclectic and pragmatic.

584

: 00:35:34

Um, whatever works from whatever source,

uh, to some extent, uh, what works

585

: 00:35:42

well for the client it came from, is

probably a good thing for that client.

586

: 00:35:47

And I, I appreciate you adding in, uh,

a quick blurb there about medicine even,

587

: 00:35:53

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: sure.

588

: 00:35:54

Russell Newton: uh, uh, modern

religions, whatever they might be.

589

: 00:35:57

Because there are different things

that work for different people.

590

: 00:36:01

And if you're tool, you know,

to the, to the man with a

591

: 00:36:04

hammer, every problem is a nail.

592

: 00:36:07

Uh,

593

: 00:36:07

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

For sure.

594

: 00:36:08

Russell Newton: you have

enough things in your toolkit.

595

: 00:36:10

You can find something that works

for the person that's struggling, you

596

: 00:36:14

can find the right thing for them.

597

: 00:36:16

And I think positive psychology, uh,

maybe comes closest to that of, of

598

: 00:36:22

most anything we've seen in, in our

lifetime of finding the thing that

599

: 00:36:26

works best for the particular situation.

600

: 00:36:28

And going from there.

601

: 00:36:29

I also appreciate what

you said about thriving.

602

: 00:36:32

Uh, you know, we shouldn't be

satisfied with being, okay, there's

603

: 00:36:37

a commercial out now that's fine.

604

: 00:36:39

Is not okay.

605

: 00:36:40

Or something O okay is not good

enough, or I forget exactly.

606

: 00:36:43

I don't even know what it's for.

607

: 00:36:44

I've seen it once or twice,

but it basically, you know,

608

: 00:36:47

average, um, making it from day

to day isn't what life is about.

609

: 00:36:52

we should, we should look for,

uh, something better than that.

610

: 00:36:55

Taking all those things that make us

the person who we are and funneling

611

: 00:37:00

them thrive and excel in, in.

612

: 00:37:04

The appropriate areas that may be

business, that may be most likely it's

613

: 00:37:07

in personal relationships and, uh,

the way we see the world and deal with

614

: 00:37:12

others, but could be in other, could

be in academics, could be in sports,

615

: 00:37:15

could be in a number of things as well.

616

: 00:37:16

But it still comes back to

that fundamental piece of

617

: 00:37:20

relationships and presence,

618

: 00:37:22

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Sure.

619

: 00:37:23

And, and I, yeah, and, and I think I'll

interject there for just a quick moment.

620

: 00:37:27

I, I, I think what they're attempting

to do, right, specifically with,

621

: 00:37:31

uh, you know, positive psychology

and that kind of movement, it's.

622

: 00:37:35

I mean, there's, it's, it's kind of

the, what people call kind of the

623

: 00:37:39

fourth wave of psychology, right?

624

: 00:37:41

The first kind of being psychodynamic

and Freud and you know, then

625

: 00:37:45

behaviorism and then kind of

humanism, which is really more similar

626

: 00:37:49

to what positive psychology is.

627

: 00:37:51

And then, you know, positive psychology

really being that fourth wave, that fourth

628

: 00:37:55

movement, uh, with really that emphasis.

629

: 00:37:59

And, and I think what they're

attempting to do, and I feel like

630

: 00:38:02

they're doing quite a good job.

631

: 00:38:03

And I appreciate you differentiating

between, you know, kind of, you know,

632

: 00:38:08

what, what people would consider

kind of positive psychology, right?

633

: 00:38:11

And that movement, that's evidence-based,

it's, it's built on practice, uh,

634

: 00:38:16

versus kind of pop psychology, right?

635

: 00:38:19

Which, which sometimes are these kind

of terms, right, that arise, right?

636

: 00:38:24

Whether it be from kind of a

popular speaker or something on

637

: 00:38:28

social media or whatever, right?

638

: 00:38:30

And sometimes they're, they're useful.

639

: 00:38:33

They can even be kind of

connected to maybe a deeper truth.

640

: 00:38:37

Uh, but I find that a lot of

times they are not, um, and,

641

: 00:38:41

and can actually create a mental

expectation that becomes an obstacle.

642

: 00:38:48

Um, you know, and, and so I

mean, I'll give you kind of a,

643

: 00:38:52

and this is a simple example.

644

: 00:38:54

Uh, and, and I know that as soon as I

say it, I'm gonna, I'm gonna create some

645

: 00:38:59

problems for myself, but that's okay.

646

: 00:39:00

I'll back it up and I'll,

I'll, I'll do the best I can.

647

: 00:39:03

But it's kind of like, think of it

like the self-care movement, right?

648

: 00:39:07

You know, there's, there's a lot

of talk about, you know, self-care

649

: 00:39:09

and you gotta care for the self.

650

: 00:39:11

And, and of course that

that's true, right?

651

: 00:39:14

Russell, like, I'm not here to say like,

you know, you should treat yourself like

652

: 00:39:17

trash and don't do anything for yourself,

because that's just ridiculous, right?

653

: 00:39:21

Uh, and obviously we, we

have to care for ourselves.

654

: 00:39:25

We have to care about our lives.

655

: 00:39:28

Um, but the reality is that other care.

656

: 00:39:34

Is actually a much

better mood boost, right?

657

: 00:39:39

So if you're interested in raising

the way that you feel like improving

658

: 00:39:45

your wellness, your meaning, your

mattering in life, the quickest

659

: 00:39:50

path to that isn't self-care.

660

: 00:39:53

It's other care.

661

: 00:39:55

So the more the, yeah, the, the,

the less time we spend obsessed

662

: 00:39:58

about our own happiness, and

the more time we spend, right?

663

: 00:40:03

Caring for others, doing things

and being engaged in things that

664

: 00:40:08

matter, whether to your life or in

things that are larger than you.

665

: 00:40:12

The evidence says like

that's the quickest path.

666

: 00:40:16

Happiness.

667

: 00:40:17

Like now, the quickest path now is that,

and so yes, you can have your bubble

668

: 00:40:23

bath and you can get your massage and

you can do these wonderful things,

669

: 00:40:26

of course, like do those things.

670

: 00:40:29

But just realize, right, that what

the adv, what the evidence is actually

671

: 00:40:34

saying is in the short and long term,

that other care is actually a better

672

: 00:40:39

form of treatment instead of self-care.

673

: 00:40:43

Right?

674

: 00:40:44

And I know that this sounds

a little competitive, right?

675

: 00:40:46

I'm kind of like, well, you know, this is

better than the other and this is better.

676

: 00:40:50

And we do have a way, we have a

tendency, right, to view things

677

: 00:40:53

within this like, well, one is

better, or which one is the firth?

678

: 00:40:57

Or which, and actually it

doesn't need to be like that.

679

: 00:41:00

We, we have this, I don't know why we

we're always trying to, to place things

680

: 00:41:05

kind of in this hierarchical way, and

I don't think it needs to be that way.

681

: 00:41:09

Like I, I think caring for our lives.

682

: 00:41:13

Of massive importance and of equal

importance is making sure that

683

: 00:41:18

our focus is engaged in caring,

in altruistic type pursuits.

684

: 00:41:25

Because that's just

what the evidence shows.

685

: 00:41:28

And so, and I mean, there's

a million of these, right?

686

: 00:41:31

Where we're just, you know, like the, the

whole idea of like, you know, live your

687

: 00:41:35

truth or that term doesn't even make sense

to me because the moment you put yours

688

: 00:41:40

before truth, like it's no longer truth.

689

: 00:41:42

Like it's, I mean, you could say, you

could say like, you know, live your

690

: 00:41:46

opinion or your beliefs, sure do that.

691

: 00:41:49

But, but, but don't mistake yours

and truth, even though I suppose

692

: 00:41:55

at some point it could be right.

693

: 00:41:56

We're now we're talking about kind of

philosophical objective or absolute

694

: 00:42:00

truth, but I, I just think we get

ourselves in the trouble and it's

695

: 00:42:04

quite arrogant, I think, to think that.

696

: 00:42:08

To kind of label that erroneously.

697

: 00:42:10

And so little things like that.

698

: 00:42:13

And, and these are more like soapbox type

things for me, but I am, I have to say,

699

: 00:42:18

right, I mean, as a therapist of 20 years,

like wordsmithing is kind of what I do.

700

: 00:42:25

Russell Newton: Right.

701

: 00:42:26

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

we speak matter.

702

: 00:42:27

They matter because

703

: 00:42:31

they provide structure to our reality.

704

: 00:42:33

Like it's how we say it, how we

say it, how we think it, how we

705

: 00:42:37

frame it becomes the reality.

706

: 00:42:39

And so communicating in ways that

I feel are helpful, encouraging.

707

: 00:42:50

And are actually built kind of

on a foundation of truth matters.

708

: 00:42:53

And I think when we don't,

I, I think we actually harm

709

: 00:42:56

ourselves and others a little bit.

710

: 00:42:57

And I, I don't wanna be disparaging 'cause

that's not useful either, but things

711

: 00:43:03

like that bother me a little bit because

712

: 00:43:08

I, I think they create

expectations that don't help us.

713

: 00:43:14

Like I, I'll give you another

example, Russ, and I'm probably

714

: 00:43:17

boring you to pieces here, but,

715

: 00:43:19

Russell Newton: No.

716

: 00:43:19

No.

717

: 00:43:19

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: and

this is not a, an uncommon thing, right?

718

: 00:43:22

I mean, I, I've, I've got this, just

these five unbelievable kids, right?

719

: 00:43:25

And, and, um, you know, and, and here,

for example, in my house, like we,

720

: 00:43:32

we don't, we don't say the F word.

721

: 00:43:33

And, and the f word doesn't

mean like the f bomb.

722

: 00:43:36

It, it's like, it's the word fair.

723

: 00:43:40

I feel like fairness is an

incorrect construct, right?

724

: 00:43:43

It's just not a good construct.

725

: 00:43:44

Right?

726

: 00:43:45

And I'll add to that f word, to the

word, the D word, which is deserve.

727

: 00:43:49

I don't do deserve, I don't do

deserve, and I don't do fairness,

728

: 00:43:53

because those two constructs create

an incorrect expectation in our minds

729

: 00:43:58

that ultimately leads to bitterness.

730

: 00:44:00

It leads to us being upset.

731

: 00:44:02

It leads to weird comparisons

that aren't helpful.

732

: 00:44:06

And so I tell my kids all the

time, like I, I honestly just

733

: 00:44:09

don't even use that word.

734

: 00:44:11

I, I just, I try to find a different one.

735

: 00:44:13

Whether it's, I try to be

just, I try to be equitable.

736

: 00:44:17

I try to be.

737

: 00:44:19

Wise.

738

: 00:44:21

Uh, but I don't, I don't do fair.

739

: 00:44:23

I'm not here to make things

look the same between you.

740

: 00:44:25

My kids, like, if I want to treat this

one this way and give them this and

741

: 00:44:29

this one this way, because I think

that's the best thing that I can do,

742

: 00:44:33

then that's exactly what I'll do.

743

: 00:44:34

And I, I don't work within

that fairness construct.

744

: 00:44:37

Right.

745

: 00:44:38

And the deserving one, it's,

it's basically a ploy to

746

: 00:44:43

get you to buy something.

747

: 00:44:44

It's like, you know, you deserve this.

748

: 00:44:46

Yeah.

749

: 00:44:46

I don't, I don't do that.

750

: 00:44:47

Doesn't make sense to me.

751

: 00:44:49

It once again creates a, I think

an an odd expectation of me being

752

: 00:44:55

entitled or deserving of something.

753

: 00:44:58

If I want something, then I better

get out there and work for it

754

: 00:45:01

and do the best I can to get it.

755

: 00:45:03

But I don't, I don't do deserves, yeah.

756

: 00:45:05

I don't do deserves

757

: 00:45:06

Russell Newton: Yeah, that's, uh,

758

: 00:45:07

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: so.

759

: 00:45:08

Russell Newton: great

parenting device advice.

760

: 00:45:11

Great boss advice.

761

: 00:45:13

Uh, great coach, great teacher advice.

762

: 00:45:16

Anybody that has, people that

they're working with, uh, in a, in

763

: 00:45:21

a, some kind of leadership position.

764

: 00:45:23

Yeah, whatever it might be.

765

: 00:45:24

So many things in there.

766

: 00:45:26

Uh, I wanna go back and pick

up just a few questions.

767

: 00:45:28

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

I love it.

768

: 00:45:29

Russell Newton: of my own.

769

: 00:45:30

I love.

770

: 00:45:31

Live your truth in scratching

out the, your, uh, just don't we

771

: 00:45:36

simplify that and just live truth,

772

: 00:45:39

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

I like that.

773

: 00:45:40

Russell Newton: uh, because your

truth, you know, and I, you couch that.

774

: 00:45:44

And of course there's some,

some understanding there that

775

: 00:45:47

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah.

776

: 00:45:48

Russell Newton: can't live another

person's life, but if I live real

777

: 00:45:52

truth, my truth will be truth.

778

: 00:45:55

That, that's very strong.

779

: 00:45:56

I, I just like that phrase, scratch

out, leave out your live truth.

780

: 00:46:01

Um, and part of what you said, a good

part of that reminded me, you talked

781

: 00:46:05

about other care, uh, reminded me of

Stephen Covey's, uh, I believe I'm

782

: 00:46:11

attributing the, the phrase correctly.

783

: 00:46:13

You know, don't try to be

understood, try to understand.

784

: 00:46:17

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah,

785

: 00:46:18

Russell Newton: and that's, that's the

same concept as other care, I believe.

786

: 00:46:21

I think you're taking a little

bit further with more than.

787

: 00:46:24

Um, the one is more like in, in a

conversational basis, but you are

788

: 00:46:28

talking about in a real hands-on

relational way to seek to help others

789

: 00:46:33

in some way, and that is the quickest

way to happiness and self-satisfaction.

790

: 00:46:39

That's, that's quite strong.

791

: 00:46:40

I appreciate that.

792

: 00:46:42

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

you bet.

793

: 00:46:42

Yeah.

794

: 00:46:42

That's a great, uh, I, I love that book.

795

: 00:46:46

I think that was one of

his seven habits, right?

796

: 00:46:48

Was seek first to understand

then to be understood.

797

: 00:46:52

Um, interestingly enough, right?

798

: 00:46:55

That was.

799

: 00:46:56

I think that that book was significant

enough because it created that

800

: 00:46:59

little bit of a shift, right?

801

: 00:47:01

From kind of this, the

psychology of, of illness, right?

802

: 00:47:06

To a psychology of success, right?

803

: 00:47:08

Seven habits of highly effective people.

804

: 00:47:11

Like that was kind of that paradigm

shift to let's look at what brings joy

805

: 00:47:17

instead of just, you know, how do we,

'cause in a way, it's, it's one thing

806

: 00:47:22

to help someone feel less sad or less

anxious, and it's a whole other to

807

: 00:47:29

help somebody feel joy or to live a,

a li or, or like to feel confident.

808

: 00:47:35

Those are two different things.

809

: 00:47:36

Russell Newton: that's such a huge

difference and we don't always see that.

810

: 00:47:38

Yeah.

811

: 00:47:39

Um, yeah, again, to the, the thriving

to, to thrive in life, you know, just

812

: 00:47:47

feeling better is not good enough.

813

: 00:47:50

uh, we should move beyond that and

not be satisfied with the average.

814

: 00:47:54

That's fantastic.

815

: 00:47:55

I did want to go back one, uh,

man's search for meaning the

816

: 00:47:59

Viktor Frankl, is that correct?

817

: 00:48:02

Yeah.

818

: 00:48:02

I just wanted to make sure I had

that in my head and I wanted to, uh.

819

: 00:48:06

I sure that's the book that

we were referencing there.

820

: 00:48:10

It's interesting I didn't plan the

segue, but, uh, your comment reminded

821

: 00:48:14

me of Stephen Covey, and we're getting

close to, uh, the timeframe here.

822

: 00:48:18

I usually end the podcast with two

questions, and one of them relates

823

: 00:48:21

to Covey's book, the Seven Habits.

824

: 00:48:24

Uh, do you find in your life

825

: 00:48:28

that you have certain habits that, uh,

and, and could be what, what frequently

826

: 00:48:34

comes up is a habit of gratitude,

gratitude journaling, or a morning

827

: 00:48:38

stack, um, know, certain things that

people do, uh, a uh, set aside time

828

: 00:48:45

for reading and learning, you know, a,

a cold plunge, whatever it might be.

829

: 00:48:49

On a physical side, it

might be a spiritual.

830

: 00:48:51

Uh, do you have things in your life

that you'd be willing to share that

831

: 00:48:55

you would recommend as far as a habit

stack or in light of Stephen Covey's

832

: 00:49:01

book, that Habits of Successful People?

833

: 00:49:03

Uh.

834

: 00:49:04

Maybe pulling from the, the whole concept

of positive psychology, which enc, which

835

: 00:49:08

encapsulates a lot of things there that

you could recommend, uh, for listeners

836

: 00:49:13

to, consider incorporating their life

to help improve their, their mindset,

837

: 00:49:18

their self concept, and, and so forth.

838

: 00:49:22

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah,

I'll, I'll, I'll share a couple that

839

: 00:49:24

have been, uh, I think a part of my life.

840

: 00:49:27

Um, and I would say, uh, I

mean I, I, I'm a family man.

841

: 00:49:33

I, I've got, I mean, my spouse

and, and my five children and that,

842

: 00:49:39

so I would say caring for them.

843

: 00:49:41

I, I have to just say like, I

mean, that, that is, there is a

844

: 00:49:45

hierarchy there for me, right.

845

: 00:49:47

And, and that lands squarely

as, as number one, right?

846

: 00:49:51

And, and when I feel like I am doing

well there, I, I think that frees my

847

: 00:49:58

mind to do well in these other areas.

848

: 00:50:01

Right?

849

: 00:50:01

And so this, this kind of.

850

: 00:50:04

Private success, uh, precedes some

of my other success, I think is

851

: 00:50:09

act, interestingly enough, we're,

we're quoting Stephen Covey, I

852

: 00:50:12

think that's what he said, private

successes, proceed public successes.

853

: 00:50:16

And so that's a really important one.

854

: 00:50:18

It reminds me of another quote, you

know, like, you know, no, what was it?

855

: 00:50:23

Like no other success can compensate

for failure in the home kind of concept.

856

: 00:50:28

And so that, that's a really key piece

for me is I just, man, when that part

857

: 00:50:35

of my life is, is not well, uh, it's,

it's my mood, my focus is impacted.

858

: 00:50:46

And so what I would say is do what

you can to invest deeply there.

859

: 00:50:52

Simply be even from just

a, a hedonistic way.

860

: 00:50:56

Like, just because when it

isn't, the impact is so.

861

: 00:51:01

It's, it's, it's powerful.

862

: 00:51:04

Um, but, but I would say more of a habit.

863

: 00:51:07

Uh, and I, and, and I'm not

obviously perfect at this

864

: 00:51:10

all the time, and sometimes

significantly better than others.

865

: 00:51:14

Uh, and I'll take this

one from Tony Robbins.

866

: 00:51:16

I don't, I'm sure you all,

everybody knows who Tony is.

867

: 00:51:18

He's just like a fabulous speaker.

868

: 00:51:20

And, but he talked about, I

mean, years and years ago.

869

: 00:51:24

I, I remember listening to one of

his little CD collections and, and he

870

: 00:51:28

talked about this hour of power, which

is kind of a habit stack or, or kind

871

: 00:51:33

of a, a, uh, a miracle morning type

idea of just when I begin my days.

872

: 00:51:41

Um, and this is just my own personal,

right when I begin my days with a

873

: 00:51:47

run, uh, either alone, preferably

with friends, like it's even

874

: 00:51:52

better when I do it with friends.

875

: 00:51:53

But even when I do it

alone and I try to stack.

876

: 00:51:57

Some learning during that run, whether I'm

listening to a podcast or a book, uh, or

877

: 00:52:03

even something that's kind of spiritual.

878

: 00:52:06

Uh, and by the time I put,

879

: 00:52:12

before I even eat a piece of toast

or, or have a yogurt in the morning,

880

: 00:52:17

like I feel like my day is a success.

881

: 00:52:20

Uh, and, and that impacts my

mood so much in the mornings

882

: 00:52:27

that I almost become annoying.

883

: 00:52:29

And, and I, and I say this jokingly

because my, my wife will say that to

884

: 00:52:34

me and she's such an awesome person,

but she's just like, oh my gosh, you're

885

: 00:52:37

like, you're so annoying right now.

886

: 00:52:39

And it's in part because I'm just like.

887

: 00:52:42

Joyous.

888

: 00:52:43

Like I just feel good like in the morning

when I create this little miracle morning.

889

: 00:52:51

And it's a combination of you

doing something physical, right?

890

: 00:52:55

Something educational, something

spiritual, whatever that is, whatever,

891

: 00:52:59

whatever your practice looks like.

892

: 00:53:01

Whether that's beginning your day

with a walk, with a swim, with

893

: 00:53:05

meditation, with yoga, with a walk

with your partner or your spouse

894

: 00:53:09

or with your dog, whatever that is.

895

: 00:53:12

But I'm telling you like just

crank that engine and get it

896

: 00:53:15

going and reap the benefits.

897

: 00:53:18

So I would definitely say do what you can.

898

: 00:53:22

Do what you can.

899

: 00:53:23

And I'm not here to

create pressure for you.

900

: 00:53:24

Like, and by the way, I am not here to

create happiness for you to be happy.

901

: 00:53:28

Like you gotta be happy.

902

: 00:53:29

But I would just say if you can find

a way to add a miracle morning to your

903

: 00:53:35

life, um, a little routine, whether it's.

904

: 00:53:39

15 minutes, 30 minutes, uh, I

think you'll see real impact, like

905

: 00:53:44

real impact, like in your life,

in, in your success, in your mood,

906

: 00:53:49

potentially even in your relationships.

907

: 00:53:52

Uh, so I would definitely say that.

908

: 00:53:54

And then the other suggestion that I would

give, and I think positive psychology

909

: 00:53:57

is, is I think doing a wonderful job.

910

: 00:54:00

I think talking specifically about

the way that we connect to people

911

: 00:54:05

finding purpose and meaning in lives.

912

: 00:54:07

And I would just say

just as your friend, like

913

: 00:54:13

find a way to connect to things

that are just larger than you.

914

: 00:54:18

And the evidence is so

overwhelmingly good there.

915

: 00:54:21

And I, and that could be a

variety of things, right?

916

: 00:54:25

All the way to a sports community, a

community in your area, a group in your

917

: 00:54:33

area, a sports team, wherever you are.

918

: 00:54:36

Obviously like communities

of religion, right?

919

: 00:54:40

Or, or other philosophies.

920

: 00:54:42

Like the evidence is just so good, right?

921

: 00:54:45

When you find those things that

are larger than you and you connect

922

: 00:54:50

to those, and perhaps even more

importantly, when you connect to those

923

: 00:54:54

people in those communities, right?

924

: 00:54:57

I would just suggest to you find

something like that and join it and be

925

: 00:55:03

a part of it, um, because the evidence

is really, really good at not only

926

: 00:55:10

that, increasing your overall sense of

joy, meaning purpose, and happiness.

927

: 00:55:15

Uh, but it's also really important

for you to just be within those little

928

: 00:55:22

communities and creating these little

networks that there's a, a great little,

929

: 00:55:29

um, quote and I'll massacre it, but

it's something to the effect of like.

930

: 00:55:36

Um, people multiply your,

well, let's see, relationships.

931

: 00:55:42

Multiply your joys and divide

your sorrows, something like that.

932

: 00:55:46

Positive relationships.

933

: 00:55:47

Multiply your joys and divide your

sorrows, and that's what you're doing.

934

: 00:55:51

Um, and there might be some of

you that are like, well, you're

935

: 00:55:54

a, well, what if I hate people?

936

: 00:55:56

Or what if I'm not very good socially?

937

: 00:55:58

Or what if I'm this And, and, uh.

938

: 00:56:02

I would just respond with nothing

but just love and compassion.

939

: 00:56:05

But I would also gently challenge you

a little bit, and I would challenge you

940

: 00:56:09

right away with this in a cognitive way

by saying, um, you're, you're describing

941

: 00:56:14

yourself as this rigid individual that

doesn't change or as enabled to change.

942

: 00:56:21

And the reality is that we're

the most sophisticated pieces

943

: 00:56:24

of machinery in the universe.

944

: 00:56:26

Like, and it's not survival

of the fittest, it's survival

945

: 00:56:29

of the most adaptable.

946

: 00:56:30

Like that's why you've survived this far.

947

: 00:56:32

'cause we adapt, we evolve, we grow.

948

: 00:56:36

And so I would say yes, more challenging,

more difficult, perhaps you even

949

: 00:56:42

lack some aptitude or whatever.

950

: 00:56:44

But I'm just telling you, this

is what the evidence says.

951

: 00:56:49

Take yourself, drop yourself in the

middle of these people, places and

952

: 00:56:53

things and do what you can to engage

and create a little network there

953

: 00:56:58

because it's absolutely lifesaving.

954

: 00:57:00

So.

955

: 00:57:02

Anyways, couple of thoughts.

956

: 00:57:04

Russell Newton: fantastic.

957

: 00:57:04

I appreciate your, um, consistently

presenting evidence-based material.

958

: 00:57:12

Uh, what it, it's really a, it's a phrase

that we have in the podcast description

959

: 00:57:17

that it's, it is evidence-based, it's

not, and maybe that's a difference in

960

: 00:57:21

positive psychology and pop psychology.

961

: 00:57:23

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

sure, sure.

962

: 00:57:25

Russell Newton: Tony Robbins.

963

: 00:57:25

You know, when I first heard

of Tony Robbins, I thought,

964

: 00:57:28

yeah, it's pop psychology.

965

: 00:57:29

It's somebody, uh, you know, he is

a good, he is, he's charismatic.

966

: 00:57:33

He,

967

: 00:57:33

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yes,

968

: 00:57:34

Russell Newton: well.

969

: 00:57:35

He can control a room.

970

: 00:57:36

He can, but,

971

: 00:57:37

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: I.

972

: 00:57:38

Russell Newton: as I've learned a little

bit more about him, I find that he is,

973

: 00:57:41

uh, he has some powerful things that can

really be beneficial for a lot of people.

974

: 00:57:47

Uh.

975

: 00:57:48

And one last thing on my part, you,

you mentioned part of a bigger story.

976

: 00:57:51

One of my earliest, one of the first

record interviews that I did, I don't

977

: 00:57:54

like to call 'em interviews, uh,

conversations I did on the podcast,

978

: 00:57:58

uh, was with a businessman in, in

Minneapolis, and he has a, a, a small

979

: 00:58:04

business, uh, 50 employees or so.

980

: 00:58:06

But the employees that are in the company,

no one has ever left his employee.

981

: 00:58:12

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Wow.

982

: 00:58:13

Russell Newton: And that,

that to me is astounding.

983

: 00:58:15

Right?

984

: 00:58:15

Uh, and he's been in business for

many years, so it's not a, you

985

: 00:58:19

know, it's not been six months.

986

: 00:58:20

Some of them have been with him for 10

or 15 years, if I remember correctly.

987

: 00:58:23

So I asked him about that and

he, he referred to that too.

988

: 00:58:27

People wanna be part of a bigger story.

989

: 00:58:29

He references college football.

990

: 00:58:30

Uh, or any of the things that

you talked about, but people

991

: 00:58:34

wanna be recognized in that.

992

: 00:58:37

And it's necessary for a lot of people

in different ways, whatever it might be.

993

: 00:58:41

You know, if you hate

sports, there's something,

994

: 00:58:43

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Sure.

995

: 00:58:43

Russell Newton: that makes you

want to be part of a bigger story.

996

: 00:58:46

And he used that in his business

philosophy make the office part

997

: 00:58:52

of a bigger story for his people.

998

: 00:58:54

And so it wasn't just, you know, come to

work, get it over with and, and be gone.

999

: 00:58:59

It was, uh, more of a, uh, touchy feely

is the wrong phrase, but, uh, brought in

: 1000

00:59:05,838 --> 00:59:11,298

a lot of those psychological, uh, concepts

into the office to make it not just a job.

: 1001

00:59:12,408 --> 00:59:15,198

and I found that very interesting

that you referred to something very,

: 1002

00:59:15,198 --> 00:59:16,698

very similar to what he had said.

: 1003

00:59:17,598 --> 00:59:18,108

Uh.

: 1004

00:59:20,058 --> 00:59:24,348

I think, you know, in, I have two

questions that I do at the end, uh, uh,

: 1005

00:59:24,618 --> 00:59:28,398

one about habits and one about advice,

and I think you gave the exact advice that

: 1006

00:59:28,398 --> 00:59:30,528

you would've if I rephrase that question.

: 1007

00:59:30,528 --> 00:59:33,678

So, uh, we've got the two final

answers that we normally go for.

: 1008

00:59:33,678 --> 00:59:36,198

What I didn't ask you about,

and I'll give you a chance here

: 1009

00:59:36,198 --> 00:59:39,018

to, to plug your website, uh, to

: 1010

00:59:39,083 --> 00:59:39,503

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

Oh sure.

: 1011

00:59:39,618 --> 00:59:41,208

Russell Newton: you want

and give us a closing word.

: 1012

00:59:41,208 --> 00:59:42,318

If you have anything left.

: 1013

00:59:42,648 --> 00:59:46,158

Uh, you said you've written,

you've authored the book or two.

: 1014

00:59:46,788 --> 00:59:47,748

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

Yeah, I have.

: 1015

00:59:47,868 --> 00:59:49,248

Russell Newton: And we haven't

talked about those at all.

: 1016

00:59:49,248 --> 00:59:50,928

So tell us about your books.

: 1017

00:59:51,138 --> 00:59:52,578

Tell us about your website.

: 1018

00:59:52,638 --> 00:59:58,338

Uh, this is not, limited to a locality.

: 1019

00:59:58,818 --> 01:00:00,618

Best I can tell from

looking at the website.

: 1020

01:00:00,618 --> 01:00:03,648

So if schools, if parents are

interested in finding out more,

: 1021

01:00:03,648 --> 01:00:06,048

they can look@schoolpulse.org.

: 1022

01:00:06,798 --> 01:00:12,288

you provide individual services,

uh, online or even for those

: 1023

01:00:12,288 --> 01:00:15,648

local in Utah, please feel free

to share something about that.

: 1024

01:00:16,038 --> 01:00:16,428

And.

: 1025

01:00:17,148 --> 01:00:21,288

Uh, leave us with a parting word and, and

we'll sign off and let our, uh, listeners

: 1026

01:00:21,588 --> 01:00:21,858

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah.

: 1027

01:00:21,978 --> 01:00:23,208

Russell Newton: some of

this great information that

: 1028

01:00:23,208 --> 01:00:23,958

we presented to 'em today.

: 1029

01:00:24,888 --> 01:00:25,278

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: Yeah.

: 1030

01:00:25,278 --> 01:00:25,908

That's awesome.

: 1031

01:00:25,908 --> 01:00:27,828

Thank you for, for that opportunity.

: 1032

01:00:27,828 --> 01:00:28,098

Yeah.

: 1033

01:00:28,153 --> 01:00:30,198

I, I, I've written a couple of books.

: 1034

01:00:30,198 --> 01:00:34,938

One of them was Mind Over Gray Matter, um,

and that was the first one that I wrote.

: 1035

01:00:34,938 --> 01:00:36,738

And, and I just have to say that was.

: 1036

01:00:37,518 --> 01:00:40,278

Such a meaningful experience for me.

: 1037

01:00:40,303 --> 01:00:45,558

I, I, I wanna say that maybe I

was 12 or 13 years into my private

: 1038

01:00:45,558 --> 01:00:47,868

practice then, and, and it was so

: 1039

01:00:50,028 --> 01:00:50,688

awesome.

: 1040

01:00:50,928 --> 01:00:58,248

Uh, I, I think to just take some of

this stuff that was just marinating up

: 1041

01:00:58,248 --> 01:01:03,318

there in my mind, some of my experiences

and just putting them down on paper.

: 1042

01:01:03,318 --> 01:01:05,628

And I think there's a part of me

that always wanted to do that.

: 1043

01:01:05,628 --> 01:01:12,618

My mom was an unpublished, but in my

opinion, just an incredible writer, poet.

: 1044

01:01:13,548 --> 01:01:16,608

And so I think that there was

a part of me that, that wanted

: 1045

01:01:16,608 --> 01:01:17,778

to do a little bit of that.

: 1046

01:01:17,793 --> 01:01:18,948

And, and I did.

: 1047

01:01:19,458 --> 01:01:22,878

And then I followed that up with

No Thy Selfie, which is kind

: 1048

01:01:22,878 --> 01:01:24,558

of a, a book more for teens.

: 1049

01:01:25,008 --> 01:01:28,068

Uh, we're actually kind of an Amazon

bestseller, which was kind of fun.

: 1050

01:01:28,698 --> 01:01:30,108

Uh, and, and I.

: 1051

01:01:30,543 --> 01:01:31,473

And I did that.

: 1052

01:01:31,473 --> 01:01:34,863

So those are the two books is Mind Over

Gray Matter and Know Thy Selfie, and

: 1053

01:01:34,863 --> 01:01:36,723

they're available on Amazon, of course.

: 1054

01:01:36,723 --> 01:01:39,423

But, uh, and then of course School Pulse.

: 1055

01:01:39,423 --> 01:01:46,203

I obviously, we are doing, we're

serving schools, schools, districts,

: 1056

01:01:46,203 --> 01:01:49,893

private schools, state departments even.

: 1057

01:01:50,583 --> 01:01:55,833

And our goal really is

to change the paradigm.

: 1058

01:01:56,018 --> 01:02:02,313

I, I, I feel like we're, we

can be a little enamored with

: 1059

01:02:02,313 --> 01:02:05,103

just the risk factors, right?

: 1060

01:02:05,103 --> 01:02:10,383

I, I feel like a lot of our

interventions at the school level are

: 1061

01:02:10,383 --> 01:02:14,733

just interventions, meaning we're,

we're just, we're just kind of a step.

: 1062

01:02:15,453 --> 01:02:16,323

Too late.

: 1063

01:02:16,833 --> 01:02:18,243

Uh, and all of it matters.

: 1064

01:02:18,243 --> 01:02:21,603

Like I, I, I, once again, I'm,

I'm not trying to be critical.

: 1065

01:02:21,603 --> 01:02:27,333

All that I'm suggesting is a

move from intervention, which I

: 1066

01:02:27,333 --> 01:02:29,013

think is where we live, right?

: 1067

01:02:29,013 --> 01:02:34,083

It's kind of that medical model that I

described and kind of this paradigm shift

: 1068

01:02:34,083 --> 01:02:37,413

towards proactive prevention, right?

: 1069

01:02:37,833 --> 01:02:39,183

Which really falls.

: 1070

01:02:39,393 --> 01:02:42,843

It's a move away from

what are the risk factors?

: 1071

01:02:42,843 --> 01:02:47,793

What are the signs of suicides to

what are the protective factors?

: 1072

01:02:47,793 --> 01:02:49,413

Like, what are the things, right?

: 1073

01:02:49,653 --> 01:02:53,763

What are the kinds of attitudes,

behaviors, psychology, mindsets that

: 1074

01:02:53,763 --> 01:02:56,553

we could adopt into our lives, right?

: 1075

01:02:56,553 --> 01:03:02,493

That could actually insulate and protect

us from suicide, from depression, from

: 1076

01:03:02,493 --> 01:03:04,323

anxiety, from post-traumatic stress.

: 1077

01:03:05,103 --> 01:03:10,233

And, and I say that right as a

bit of a social scientist myself.

: 1078

01:03:10,938 --> 01:03:15,768

To recognize that, I know we can't

ultimately end all of those things,

: 1079

01:03:15,768 --> 01:03:18,648

but the evidence really is good, right?

: 1080

01:03:18,648 --> 01:03:26,028

That when we have these protective areas,

right, flowing nicely in our lives, right,

: 1081

01:03:26,388 --> 01:03:28,660

that they really do protect us, right?

: 1082

01:03:28,728 --> 01:03:34,158

And yes, you know, the quarterback

or the cheerleader or the this, those

: 1083

01:03:34,158 --> 01:03:36,408

people are just as vulnerable too.

: 1084

01:03:37,098 --> 01:03:40,608

But the reality is they have a, they

may have, and other people do like

: 1085

01:03:40,608 --> 01:03:45,558

a lot of protective elements that

make it less likely than they will.

: 1086

01:03:45,558 --> 01:03:49,308

And that's really what we wanna

bring to the school, is we want to

: 1087

01:03:49,308 --> 01:03:51,978

help students succeed academically.

: 1088

01:03:51,978 --> 01:03:54,408

We want them to participate

and to be engaged.

: 1089

01:03:54,408 --> 01:03:58,428

We want them to improve their

behavior and decision making, right?

: 1090

01:03:58,668 --> 01:04:02,028

So that the culture and the overall

environment at the school is better.

: 1091

01:04:02,538 --> 01:04:06,048

And that's really what we

do, but we wanna do it right.

: 1092

01:04:06,453 --> 01:04:11,403

With that less focus on just the

how do we stop suicide, which is a

: 1093

01:04:11,403 --> 01:04:13,773

good focus and we deal with that.

: 1094

01:04:14,403 --> 01:04:18,033

But man, how do we build mental fitness?

: 1095

01:04:18,123 --> 01:04:19,713

How do we build excellence?

: 1096

01:04:19,743 --> 01:04:24,003

How do we build an awesome, an

extraordinary mindset that would

: 1097

01:04:24,003 --> 01:04:26,073

ultimately lead to an extraordinary life?

: 1098

01:04:26,103 --> 01:04:27,423

Like that's where we live.

: 1099

01:04:27,993 --> 01:04:32,163

And if as a school or a district

you're interested in really doing

: 1100

01:04:32,163 --> 01:04:40,023

that, my humble pitch is we are

the solution like for that better.

: 1101

01:04:40,443 --> 01:04:43,233

And, and I think some of our

resources will show that.

: 1102

01:04:43,233 --> 01:04:45,903

And, and, and I'll share that with you.

: 1103

01:04:45,903 --> 01:04:49,443

And as far as just, you know,

any, you can reach out to me,

: 1104

01:04:49,443 --> 01:04:50,973

you can go to school post.org.

: 1105

01:04:50,973 --> 01:04:54,463

You can reach me at Iuri@schoolpost.org

: 1106

01:04:54,483 --> 01:04:54,903

as well.

: 1107

01:04:54,903 --> 01:04:56,253

It's spelled IURI.

: 1108

01:04:56,253 --> 01:05:02,433

But, um, but honestly, I, I'm just,

psychology has been so fun for me.

: 1109

01:05:02,438 --> 01:05:02,448

It.

: 1110

01:05:03,198 --> 01:05:05,088

I think it's been a positive in my life.

: 1111

01:05:05,508 --> 01:05:08,658

Uh, I feel like it can be that

way towards other people as well.

: 1112

01:05:09,378 --> 01:05:16,278

Um, but I would, I would say to

you it's, I think you actually

: 1113

01:05:16,278 --> 01:05:17,658

even made kind of a statement.

: 1114

01:05:17,808 --> 01:05:22,368

Um, you know, specifically,

it's almost as if like, it's,

: 1115

01:05:22,428 --> 01:05:24,498

it's not enough to just be okay.

: 1116

01:05:24,498 --> 01:05:26,238

The, the concept of thriving, right?

: 1117

01:05:26,478 --> 01:05:30,468

Like the idea that we can thrive,

not just survive, not just hang on.

: 1118

01:05:31,128 --> 01:05:35,358

Uh, and I think beyond even that, right?

: 1119

01:05:35,358 --> 01:05:37,668

And I'm not here to create

some pressure, right?

: 1120

01:05:37,668 --> 01:05:41,568

Like, you, you have to be happy, you

know, at, at like a seven or an eight or

: 1121

01:05:41,568 --> 01:05:43,578

don't be satisfied for a three or a four.

: 1122

01:05:44,448 --> 01:05:47,688

And, and, and I, and I think really

what I, what I'm trying, what I, what

: 1123

01:05:47,688 --> 01:05:51,618

I like to talk about is kind of this

concept of emotional maturity, right?

: 1124

01:05:51,618 --> 01:05:58,698

Which is, it's our ability to experience

the full spectrum of emotion, right?

: 1125

01:05:58,698 --> 01:06:00,558

All the way from the negative tens.

: 1126

01:06:01,293 --> 01:06:02,433

To the positive tens.

: 1127

01:06:02,433 --> 01:06:02,613

Right?

: 1128

01:06:02,613 --> 01:06:08,373

And, and certainly we want to function

more right up here on the positives

: 1129

01:06:09,153 --> 01:06:13,683

because when we are right, you know, it's,

it's like that Copernican switch, right?

: 1130

01:06:13,683 --> 01:06:19,953

Like the idea that happiness or

success revolves around happiness,

: 1131

01:06:20,403 --> 01:06:21,783

not the other way around.

: 1132

01:06:21,783 --> 01:06:24,663

And so, obviously we

want to promote wellness.

: 1133

01:06:24,663 --> 01:06:26,043

We wanna promote optimism.

: 1134

01:06:26,043 --> 01:06:30,483

We wanna promote positive feelings,

uh, and exciting feelings in our lives

: 1135

01:06:30,483 --> 01:06:31,953

because we just seem to do better.

: 1136

01:06:31,953 --> 01:06:35,403

We're more patient, we're more

resilient, we deal with things better.

: 1137

01:06:36,273 --> 01:06:41,373

Um, but it's also important to

realize that there's a real, um,

: 1138

01:06:41,583 --> 01:06:46,803

that there's real meaning in some

of those dark undertones, right?

: 1139

01:06:47,733 --> 01:06:50,283

In some of, of those pieces in our lives.

: 1140

01:06:50,283 --> 01:06:57,663

And so it's, it's less of a pressure

to be here and more maybe that

: 1141

01:06:57,663 --> 01:06:59,763

realization that every moment.

: 1142

01:07:00,528 --> 01:07:03,288

Can prepare us for the very next moment.

: 1143

01:07:03,288 --> 01:07:03,738

Right.

: 1144

01:07:04,278 --> 01:07:08,748

Um, I'm reminding, in fact, speaking

of Tony Robbins, you brought him

: 1145

01:07:08,748 --> 01:07:12,168

to mind that he used to tell this

really awesome story about Nelson

: 1146

01:07:12,168 --> 01:07:17,148

Mandela when he was, you know, kind of

unjustly in prison for like 37 years.

: 1147

01:07:17,148 --> 01:07:20,898

And that he had this interview, uh,

you know, with the reporter once he

: 1148

01:07:20,898 --> 01:07:23,928

had been released and he was president

and he had, you know, trying to

: 1149

01:07:23,928 --> 01:07:25,848

abolish apartheid in South Africa.

: 1150

01:07:26,538 --> 01:07:30,858

And he has this interview, um, allegedly.

: 1151

01:07:30,858 --> 01:07:34,218

I actually have never quite found a

record of that, but I've told this story

: 1152

01:07:34,218 --> 01:07:37,728

a million times because I think it's so

powerful, you know, and this basically

: 1153

01:07:37,728 --> 01:07:42,978

this reporter him, you know, how did you

handle the, you know, the, the injustice?

: 1154

01:07:43,008 --> 01:07:45,048

You know, how did you deal

with the suffering, right?

: 1155

01:07:45,048 --> 01:07:47,628

And, and allegedly he says what?

: 1156

01:07:47,628 --> 01:07:48,618

Suffering, right?

: 1157

01:07:48,978 --> 01:07:50,868

It was preparation, right?

: 1158

01:07:51,588 --> 01:07:57,198

And that concept, right, that we

can somehow swallow stuff, right.

: 1159

01:07:57,903 --> 01:08:03,003

And like synthesize it in there

and then to have it come out

: 1160

01:08:03,003 --> 01:08:06,363

as preparation is magnificent.

: 1161

01:08:06,483 --> 01:08:06,873

Right?

: 1162

01:08:06,873 --> 01:08:07,503

Is,

: 1163

01:08:09,963 --> 01:08:13,023

is, is That's the extraordinary mindset.

: 1164

01:08:13,293 --> 01:08:17,733

That's how we become

invincible in a sense, right?

: 1165

01:08:17,733 --> 01:08:22,202

Is, is, is we have a, a, a

psychology that just is willing,

: 1166

01:08:22,323 --> 01:08:24,332

it's open, it's soft hearted.

: 1167

01:08:24,332 --> 01:08:29,553

It's, it's kind of got that growth mindset

concept to it and it allows us to just

: 1168

01:08:29,553 --> 01:08:35,193

bounce back, not just to that normal,

but to bounce back as preparation, right?

: 1169

01:08:35,193 --> 01:08:37,502

It's actually preparing me for more.

: 1170

01:08:37,502 --> 01:08:40,148

So anyways, some fun

things to think about.

: 1171

01:08:41,542 --> 01:08:41,823

Russell Newton: Absolutely.

: 1172

01:08:41,837 --> 01:08:42,768

Thank you so much.

: 1173

01:08:42,798 --> 01:08:46,622

You know, I'm, I'm really looking forward

to editing, uh, this episode because there

: 1174

01:08:46,622 --> 01:08:48,542

are a lot of little pieces in there that.

: 1175

01:08:49,638 --> 01:08:52,667

Uh, we could go back and probably

spend another half an episode on

: 1176

01:08:52,758 --> 01:08:53,258

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

You bet.

: 1177

01:08:53,388 --> 01:08:55,428

Russell Newton: that you ran

through some really strong things

: 1178

01:08:55,428 --> 01:08:56,457

there, and I, I appreciate that.

: 1179

01:08:56,758 --> 01:08:57,138

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

You bet.

: 1180

01:08:57,138 --> 01:09:00,917

Russell Newton: Um, when I was

growing up, I grew up in church.

: 1181

01:09:00,948 --> 01:09:06,377

Uh, we were a very religious family

and my pastor at the time frequently

: 1182

01:09:06,377 --> 01:09:14,957

used the illustration of if there's

a dangerous road, uh, with a, a steep

: 1183

01:09:14,957 --> 01:09:17,028

drop off a cliff beside the road.

: 1184

01:09:18,138 --> 01:09:22,908

His approach to working with families

and with the members of the church to

: 1185

01:09:22,908 --> 01:09:28,788

put a guardrail by the road, not to put

a hospital at the bottom of the cliff.

: 1186

01:09:29,957 --> 01:09:30,428

Uh,

: 1187

01:09:30,728 --> 01:09:31,247

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

really good.

: 1188

01:09:31,968 --> 01:09:35,688

Russell Newton: which is exactly, I think

in line with what you say, prevention

: 1189

01:09:35,688 --> 01:09:39,438

and proactive, not reactive treatment.

: 1190

01:09:39,888 --> 01:09:40,877

It's difficult to do,

: 1191

01:09:41,372 --> 01:09:41,883

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse: It is.

: 1192

01:09:41,988 --> 01:09:44,028

Russell Newton: but, but

so is reactive treatment.

: 1193

01:09:44,268 --> 01:09:44,598

Uh.

: 1194

01:09:46,983 --> 01:09:48,903

Just some very great stuff there.

: 1195

01:09:48,903 --> 01:09:50,343

I really appreciate your time.

: 1196

01:09:50,823 --> 01:09:56,463

Uh, I hope the listeners got a portion

of the benefit out of this that I did

: 1197

01:09:56,463 --> 01:09:58,083

because I, I really learned a lot.

: 1198

01:09:58,653 --> 01:10:03,483

Um, listeners, this was Iuri Mellow,

and I'm gonna spell it because

: 1199

01:10:03,483 --> 01:10:05,403

it's, uh, it is Portuguese, right?

: 1200

01:10:05,673 --> 01:10:13,353

IURI, Iuri Melo, MELO, uh, author

licensed clinical social worker,

: 1201

01:10:13,803 --> 01:10:17,043

but co-founder of school plus.org.

: 1202

01:10:17,523 --> 01:10:21,663

Uh, available through that

website if you'd like to

: 1203

01:10:21,693 --> 01:10:23,973

contact him directly by email.

: 1204

01:10:25,833 --> 01:10:26,643

just some.

: 1205

01:10:26,643 --> 01:10:27,393

Fantastic.

: 1206

01:10:27,753 --> 01:10:28,713

Uh, did I say author?

: 1207

01:10:29,043 --> 01:10:31,683

Couple two books there that,

uh, we have out there that we

: 1208

01:10:31,683 --> 01:10:33,183

should, we should look at as well.

: 1209

01:10:33,363 --> 01:10:34,443

Thank you so much for your time.

: 1210

01:10:35,103 --> 01:10:39,693

I appreciate it greatly and wish you

great success, uh, with school plus.org

: 1211

01:10:39,693 --> 01:10:40,893

and, and the many other.

: 1212

01:10:41,373 --> 01:10:44,763

Ventures, you know, and, uh,

we need to do a follow up.

: 1213

01:10:44,763 --> 01:10:45,843

Maybe you can get in touch with me.

: 1214

01:10:46,053 --> 01:10:47,433

If you ever wanna do

a follow up interview.

: 1215

01:10:47,433 --> 01:10:52,443

I'd like to find out more about,

uh, your, uh, adventure therapy.

: 1216

01:10:52,443 --> 01:10:53,073

Is that what you called

: 1217

01:10:53,163 --> 01:10:53,973

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

Oh, yeah, yeah.

: 1218

01:10:54,033 --> 01:10:55,113

Adventure based therapy.

: 1219

01:10:55,113 --> 01:10:55,383

Yeah.

: 1220

01:10:55,683 --> 01:10:56,043

Russell Newton: Yeah.

: 1221

01:10:56,043 --> 01:10:56,103

It

: 1222

01:10:56,133 --> 01:10:56,973

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

kind of what I've call it.

: 1223

01:10:57,183 --> 01:10:57,483

Russell Newton: Bound.

: 1224

01:10:57,483 --> 01:10:58,233

Is it similar to that?

: 1225

01:10:58,893 --> 01:11:01,023

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

Uh, it, it, it, it is, but Outward

: 1226

01:11:01,023 --> 01:11:04,533

Bound, it's kind of done in like in

group settings or things like that.

: 1227

01:11:04,533 --> 01:11:07,293

And, and for me, it's,

it's one-on-one, right?

: 1228

01:11:07,293 --> 01:11:11,702

It's, I mean, we'll leave my office or

we will, we'll meet outside, or we'll

: 1229

01:11:11,702 --> 01:11:15,303

meet at the climbing gym and we're

just, we're doing extraordinary things.

: 1230

01:11:15,303 --> 01:11:20,973

It's, I think therapy can sometimes be

a little stale or I would definitely

: 1231

01:11:20,973 --> 01:11:24,243

say for adolescents and teenagers,

it's a little bit threatening.

: 1232

01:11:24,933 --> 01:11:27,303

Uh, but climbing is not.

: 1233

01:11:27,813 --> 01:11:28,653

Climbing is not.

: 1234

01:11:28,773 --> 01:11:32,223

And, and, and I think sometimes parents,

you know, really want their child

: 1235

01:11:32,223 --> 01:11:34,683

to come in and to gain some benefit.

: 1236

01:11:34,683 --> 01:11:38,163

And, but a lot of times for teens,

the benefit isn't, you know, that

: 1237

01:11:38,163 --> 01:11:42,393

I'm gonna give them some like, really

powerful like cognitive jewel, right.

: 1238

01:11:42,393 --> 01:11:48,813

And it's just gonna be like, uh,

for teens it, it, it has to feel

: 1239

01:11:48,813 --> 01:11:51,063

great when they're with a therapist.

: 1240

01:11:51,063 --> 01:11:54,633

Like it's, it's, I think it's almost

a little bit more emotional than it

: 1241

01:11:54,633 --> 01:11:57,763

is cognitive for them becomes more

cognitive as they become adults.

: 1242

01:11:58,063 --> 01:11:58,483

Russell Newton: Mm-hmm.

: 1243

01:11:58,783 --> 01:12:00,903

iuri melo, Co-founder SchoolPulse:

And, and the climbing experience, like

: 1244

01:12:00,903 --> 01:12:03,963

I said, is just, it's, it's so easy.

: 1245

01:12:03,993 --> 01:12:08,013

It's, it's like naturally

a trusting environment.

: 1246

01:12:08,283 --> 01:12:12,303

I mean, there's just some real cool

things that happen very quickly.

: 1247

01:12:12,723 --> 01:12:17,583

You know, when I'm belaying a kid that's

50 feet up in the air, like there's

: 1248

01:12:17,583 --> 01:12:19,833

some trust that hap and by the way Yeah.

: 1249

01:12:20,013 --> 01:12:22,533

And they're doing that to me

as well, which is kind of wild.

: 1250

01:12:23,193 --> 01:12:24,933

So it's kind of wild.

: 1251

01:12:25,668 --> 01:12:29,298

Russell Newton: Uh, and I, I thought of

this several times during the process, uh,

: 1252

01:12:29,298 --> 01:12:31,248

of your describing the, the system there.

: 1253

01:12:32,838 --> 01:12:39,408

It really is a, a great on-ramp for

the kids that need something more

: 1254

01:12:39,408 --> 01:12:41,748

extensive or something more in depth.

: 1255

01:12:42,468 --> 01:12:47,118

We talk occasionally about the

social morays or the hindrances to

: 1256

01:12:47,118 --> 01:12:48,582

someone saying, I'm in counseling.

: 1257

01:12:48,738 --> 01:12:49,698

I need counseling.

: 1258

01:12:49,968 --> 01:12:51,528

I'm thinking about getting counseling.

: 1259

01:12:51,948 --> 01:12:54,858

You know, we talk about, well call

it coaching or call it mentoring, and

: 1260

01:12:54,858 --> 01:12:57,138

you don't have that social stigma.

: 1261

01:12:58,323 --> 01:13:01,983

But I could see, you know, if I've

been getting text messages and emails

: 1262

01:13:01,983 --> 01:13:06,783

from an organization that have been

helpful, that that's just a great on-ramp

: 1263

01:13:06,783 --> 01:13:10,653

to, to lower some of those barriers

and to make those students as those

: 1264

01:13:10,653 --> 01:13:15,813

young people just, uh, more willing to

take the next step when they need it.

: 1265

01:13:15,813 --> 01:13:17,433

I think it's a great

service you're providing.

: 1266

01:13:17,613 --> 01:13:19,233

As I said, I hope you have great success.

: 1267

01:13:19,593 --> 01:13:24,513

Uh, maybe you can expand and provide

that next for college age students and

: 1268

01:13:24,513 --> 01:13:27,843

then on up into young professionals

because I think the process is very

: 1269

01:13:27,843 --> 01:13:33,633

strong, uh, and I think people at

all stages of life, there's, there's

: 1270

01:13:33,633 --> 01:13:36,963

a great bit of benefit there that

can be had for a number of people.

: 1271

01:13:37,083 --> 01:13:40,983

Alright, listeners, Iuri Mellow

author, co-founder of School

: 1272

01:13:40,983 --> 01:13:45,933

Plus I keep wanting say School

Plus, but it's school pulse.org.

: 1273

01:13:46,143 --> 01:13:48,213

Thanks for being with us today, listeners.

: 1274

01:13:48,423 --> 01:13:49,233

We'll see you next week.

: 1275

01:13:49,263 --> 01:13:49,833

Have a great one.

: 1276

01:13:50,103 --> 01:13:50,373

Bye.